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« Twenty Items of Interest (v.18)
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I Read Dead People

May 17, 2008 by Shane Vander Hart

Something I’ve noticed lately has got me thinking… why is it that a lot of Christians I know tend to gravitate to contemporary selections when it comes to extra-biblical reading?  That is if they read.  Many don’t read anything beyond fiction.  I’ve taken the opposite extreme, I tend only to read non-fiction books that are ministry, apologetics or theology related.

This is a trend I’ve seen among pastors as well.  Youth pastors tend to be the worst culprits.  There isn’t anything wrong with reading new stuff, but I tend to think that if that is all of the reading we do we are not balanced.

Also a trend I’ve seen with pastors, and youth pastors in particular, is loading up on ministry “how to” books.  Again, nothing wrong with that, but balance is they key as well.  Also I’ve noticed with many Christians a lack of desire to tread deep in theological waters.  When I see that same trend in pastors & youth pastors I am fearful.

It bothers me when I see some in ministry being shaped theologically by Rob Bell, Brian McClaren, Tony Jones, Doug Pagitt, Shane Claiborne, and Tony Campolo.  I wonder if they have read Augustine, Luther, Calvin, Wesley, Knox, and Huss.  Even perhaps some later theologians (some alive, some with the Lord) like Jonathan Edwards, James Boice, Wayne Grudem, Millard Erickson, John Stott, D. Martin Lloyd-Jones, R.C. Sproul, and many others.

The results of this from what I can see have been: theologically shallow sermons, biblically illiterate churches, confused worldviews, and a  trend to exegete the Bible based on culture rather than exegeting the culture with the Bible.

Evangelicals, by and large, don’t tend to think theologically about different positions they hold or beliefs that they have.  Recent surveys have shown that the majority of Evangelicals don’t even think Christianly.  The result being that many times in our beliefs and behavior we don’t really look that much different than the world we should desire to influence.

What do you think?  Am I off base or am I on to something?  I’d love to read your comments.

Technorati Tags: theology,reading,Christian mind,Christian worldview

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Posted in Bible and Theology, Christianity and Culture | Tagged Christian mind, Christian worldview, reading, Theology | 16 Comments

16 Responses

  1. on May 18, 2008 at 10:14 am Jamie Moffett

    Hi Shane,
    Thanks for writing. I thought you might be interested to know that a number of the folks you’ve mentioned have been interviewed in a documentary titled “The Ordinary Radicals”, to be released in theaters September 4th. For more information, check out theordinaryradicals.com
    Take care, and thanks again for writing.


  2. on May 18, 2008 at 7:37 pm Dan Stuhr

    Shane: I agree. I think most good writing was done before the influence of attention-shorteners like television, radio, the internet, electricity, cell phones, etc. I’m exaggerating a bit, but not much. Most thinkers and writers a century ago spent more time thinking and writing because…well…what else was there to do? No Cubs games on WGN back then. I’d rather read something that has stood the test of time.


  3. on May 18, 2008 at 10:14 pm Noah Braymen

    I’m right there with you brother!


  4. on May 19, 2008 at 12:52 pm John T.

    I find it interesting, even though I havnt read many older theologians, why you anyone would want to. After all, hasnt Christianity been in steady decline since their writings? And the little I know about authors like Calvin and Luther its no wonder. Its not like they were overly Nice people, in fact some of their behaviours in my mind would be down right Non Christian in belief. I think had Jesus had direct communication with them he would probably have berated them just like he did with the Pharisees.


  5. on May 20, 2008 at 7:08 am Stephanie

    I worry about a balance, too. People like Rob Bell, Brian McClaren, Shane Claiborne, and Tony Campolo are the popular theologians of the minute right now, especially with my generation. And while I have enjoyed their books, some of what they say isn’t even what I would consider theology. I am thankful for my undergraduate education where I had to read Augustine, Luther, Calvin, Stott, and Sproul. While I’ve read the former most recently the latter is what grounded me in my early stages of ministry.

    I think it needs to be considered like the chicken and the egg. You can have one without the other.


  6. on May 20, 2008 at 8:12 am Shane Vander Hart

    Jamie – I tried to go to that website, but it didn’t load for me.

    Dan & Noah – Amen, Amen

    John T. – Christianity has been in decline? Hmmmmm. Have you noticed what has been going on in the Global south? In the west any decline we have seen I can assure you has not been the result of solid theology, but I would argue it is due to a lack of it.

    I also would never claim that any Reformer or early theologian is perfect, and yes many did hold beliefs that I would disagree with. They were sinners in need of grace, just like me.

    Stephanie – A lot of what the emergent types has been more ministry related, but have throw out some sloppy theology. I applaud much of the work they have done to get us to think about our methods… it is when they tinker with the message. That is a red flag to me.


  7. on May 20, 2008 at 10:37 am societyvs

    “The results of this from what I can see have been: theologically shallow sermons, biblically illiterate churches, confused worldviews, and a trend to exegete the Bible based on culture rather than exegeting the culture with the Bible” (Shane)

    The problem isn’t reading new or old reformers in this faith – which everyone in that list can be named. The problem is people are not willing to challenge their own beliefs and see what is what with their faith. They accept the belief system of the church they are in with little to no questions – if Luther, Zwingli, or Clavin took this same stance none of us would be wondering about much of any of this.

    Watered down faith is faith that is ‘so sure’ to not have questions for the ‘mystery of God’. That’s the problem – that’s where we are getting weak sermons and shallow world-views within Christianity – ask no questions – receive no answers.

    I actually have writings by Augustine, Luther, Calvin, and Zwingli that I practically never read – but I consider who they were and what they wrote – it needs to be debated and not merely accepted as ‘wow, this guy was right’. Obviously they were not right, Calvin was outright a murderer and Luther a racist – those were the specifics – neither of which they actually sought grace for. So, when I read them, I read them with a ‘grain of salt’ – and I very rarely will read them.

    Although I do like Mclaren and Campolo (haven’t read a full book of either) – they get more play because they are asking ‘relevant questions’. Augustine just isn’t, sorry. Plus we want to be able to have this convo in our time – as Augustine had it in is his day – and we have to banter with the current theologians that want to have it. The majority of orthodox Christians do not (problem is solved for them – so why ask any questions at all?).

    But faith is not that easy – and if it is – then that faith is not worth bantering about anyways. We need to have questions about God, about the teachings, about eschatology, about culture and the faith, tolerance, etc. There are real things happening in the real world we need to look at and wrestle with – things God is letting us see and banter about. Like Abraham – we need to move forward and not stop and tent – faith needs to be a live, moving one. So we will wrestle with issues of abortion, homosexuality, poverty, wealth, power, patriotism, and whatever else modern issue needs to be debated.


  8. on May 20, 2008 at 11:48 am Christian Striver

    Great post Shane. Check out C.S. Lewis on this same topic:

    “I do not wish the ordinary reader to read no modern books. But if he must read only the new or only the old, I would advise him to read the old. A new book is still on its trial and the amateur is not in a position to judge it. It has to be tested against the great body of Christian thought down the ages, and all its hidden implications (often unsuspected by the author himself) have to be brought to light.”


  9. on May 21, 2008 at 1:55 pm Rev. T

    I agree 100% it is all about balance. I have read older than new, I am finishing up St. Irenaeus Against the Heresies (the first book) now.

    At the same time though, I think you have to read some new as well. As much as I hate to admit it, I don’t always have the best idea! SO reading other current perspectives can be a very good thing. With any book you read, you have to look at who wrote it, and when it was written.

    I do think that we are seeing a shift in Christianity right now. You pointed out shallow sermons, and the like. One thing that I have seen more and more of, is Church becoming a money machine. The super churches are the new big thing, and in my opinion they are missing the point! We need a shift back to smaller churches where we can take care of each other.


  10. on May 22, 2008 at 7:01 am Amy Maxwell

    Agreed.

    Some are interested in reading classic Christian writings but don’t know where to begin.

    I just started reading [and blogging] Devotional Classics edited by Foster and Smith. It gives a good taste of many great authors.


  11. on May 22, 2008 at 7:38 am Shane Vander Hart

    Steve (Christian Striver) – great quote.

    John T – I don’t mean to imply that we shouldn’t read new stuff… if that were the case I’m not practicing what I’m “preaching”.

    Amy – great suggestion, thanks!


  12. on May 22, 2008 at 1:02 pm Irene

    I sometimes really wish I read more ‘Christian’ books but mostly I just want to relax when I read. There are some really good Christian books- I have been struggling through ‘Desiring God’ by John Piper for a really long time. It is very very good (imo) but very theological and requires a lot of concentration, so mostly I just go for the entertaining relaxing reads. I often wish that there was more Christian fiction available, I am sorry to say I find a lot of christian fiction corny. Also I have tried C.S. Lewis which came highly recommended and I know it is a classic and everyone who considers themselves ‘literary’ should do well with, but it just hasn’t grabbed me…?


  13. on May 22, 2008 at 7:30 pm absolutegrace

    Thanks for bringing more attention to some great ‘dead’ authors! That’s pretty much all I read, too. But as you and others noted, there’s some good ‘alive’ ones out there–but they seem primarily influenced by the dead ones! LOL

    I initially found your post as I join the thousands of others grieving and praying with the Chapman family. Thank you for bringing their loss and need for prayer to the forefront. May we all keep the Chapmans in prayer for many, many weeks to come.

    In Him, Linda


  14. on May 22, 2008 at 8:21 pm Random links and a quick update » GentleWhisper.com - By Amy Maxwell

    […] Thoughts – Stimulating musings from a Jesus-loving caffeine addict. Here’s one post I liked: I read dead people « What lies behind a locked […]


  15. on May 29, 2008 at 3:08 pm Twenty Items of Interest (v.19) « Caffeinated Thoughts

    […] 11.  If you haven’t already found this gem, I highly recommend the Christian Classics Ethreal Library where you can read works by some great dead people. […]


  16. on June 29, 2008 at 7:10 pm aworthydiscussion

    Very true, but we can’t just appeal the Authority of Dead people, we should appeal to the authority of the bible and how these dead people pushed that as their authority.

    The problems with many of these new breed theologians if one can call them that is that they acknowledge no authority past themselves.



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